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 Why Rana and Shah people get a fake hard on

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Posted on 06-30-13 8:36 AM     Reply [Subscribe]
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Why do Rana and Shah people out there call each other Raja, Rani and Maharani and get a fake hard on all the time. Have they forgotten that Raja Rani have been driven out and it's not cool anymore.

I get a headache each time I hear them calling each other Raja rani khaisyos, laisyosh, hagisyosh, paadisyosh.

Maybe I'm just very simple guy.

 
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Posted on 06-30-13 10:32 AM     [Snapshot: 191]     Reply [Subscribe]
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There are some questions  to be cleared of.
1. Who do they call Raja/Rani?
2. Do they ask/expect you to call them Raja/Rani?
3. Do they ask you to speak in such language?
4. Are they your friends?
5. Sometimes people are just jealous. Are you?
 
Posted on 06-30-13 11:55 AM     [Snapshot: 269]     Reply [Subscribe]
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 Shrestha babu,
I also get headache when some people speak tata mata lata pata etc...
May be I wanna be simple guy too.

 
Posted on 06-30-13 8:05 PM     [Snapshot: 606]     Reply [Subscribe]
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@ Shresthababu: Recently,  there is an uprising of BLACK ENGLISH  in American society. Medias are saying its OK for black people to use slur against other race  b/c thats how they grew up in their community. 

Are you one of them?

Because in my society in Nepal, we were taught to engage with proper etiquette and manners. And language is one of them. Now we are grown up and thousand miles away from home, still we speak that way. I don't see any harm to anyone else.

Shrestha babu-ji, I think you're upset b/c kathmandu valley is full of houses. No more places to plant mula and carrot.
 
Posted on 06-30-13 8:25 PM     [Snapshot: 638]     Reply [Subscribe]
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 SIS..Do Shrestha people work in field? 
 
Posted on 06-30-13 8:36 PM     [Snapshot: 632]     Reply [Subscribe]
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Ok, I agree I am not fan of Shreshthababu's negative tone. But hey, let's get over the tone! This guy got some point that is worth discussing. 

One of the very big setbacks in Nepalese societies is its hierarchical systems. There are almost unpenetrateable strata where people set up. Do some people jump from one to another, yes. There are many symbols people like to maintain to signify/glorify their level. In other words, people project many ways to feel good about themselves. The devise languages, attires, traits so that there is some constant reminder for them. 

What Sexy-in-Sari is saying: I couldn't agree with you more about carrying forward 'proper etiquettes and manners', but I invite you to present a fact based on whether this 'etiquette' is shown indiscriminately to everyone or to only certain people? Be honest, dear. In Nepal, would you address your 'mula and carrot produce' with the aaishyo? To a janitor brooming near Lainchaur? To a vegetable vendor 'madhesi'? Are they in that 'aaishyo' category? One needs not wonder.

Do I have problem when people address each other with that? Heck, no. But lets not sugarcoat it with 'manners'. Sometimes cigar is just a cigar. Nepal is a super hierarchical society, which seems to be getting worse. 

 
Posted on 06-30-13 9:03 PM     [Snapshot: 710]     Reply [Subscribe]
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Eutab4
You pose a more credible question, but you are viewing our culture from the eyes of western definition of equality and that is not fair.
Let me ask you this, what do you say to your dad? Tapai, if not hajur..right? What about a person younger to you? Timi/Ta? Why not use the same designation? Why discriminate on age? Similarly, a person in respectable position is typically addressed tapai, while counterparts are called timi. Shall we equalize that too?

You will say, hajur is used for one's own and tapai for others. You failed to go to the history of these cultures. One culture accepted "hajur" and now is in interaction with another culture who routinely addresses the first one with "tapai." I hope you agree it won't make sense to force my "Hajur" to your culture while you clearly are more comfortable with "tapai."
Do you still call it setbacks/discrimination? Please don't force every single practice you had just because we now have "democracy."
 
Posted on 06-30-13 9:39 PM     [Snapshot: 787]     Reply [Subscribe]
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 Its their culture. some say hajur some say tapain some say ta. wat all this fuss about? live and let live.
 
Posted on 06-30-13 9:39 PM     [Snapshot: 759]     Reply [Subscribe]
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Although the originator's comment does not deserve a response, I found Eutab4's analysis worth responding to. You are very correct that our society is very heirarchical and whether patriotic Nepalis agree or not, the system itself is very discriminatory.

The so called high class society looks down upon other class of Nepalis who does not speak a certain way. There is still a large remnant of the untouchable system that is encouraged by hinduism. Although a more modern strata of the society claims to have taken a more democratic outlook, the society is immersed in discriminatory ways from the roots.

Unless we get rid of hindu discriminatory classes, and our discriminatory language, our society will never be able to change.

 
Posted on 06-30-13 10:06 PM     [Snapshot: 801]     Reply [Subscribe]
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Hahahah Giardino, peace pal!! It's just a discussion. We all are certainly going to live. 

Kiddo, are you somehow offended by my comments? I am not proposing to force my way into everyone's throat. Not at all. I am not really, still why are you so afraid of looking 'in' from the western's viewpoint? I don't see that vaste difference in the cultural progression of societies. Didn't all the societies start basically from the same 'eye for an eye' status? Aren't all basically following the same path? Call it modernism, call it democracy, call it westernization, call it whatever...all are headed in the same direction..from the US to Nepal, Tashkant to Tehran. Are we all in different timeline of such progression? Absolutely, yes.. Several hundred years difference in some cases. Even upto 1920s, western women didn't show their ankles. We started defying that not too long ago. 

Now, let's talk history: basically every culture held that ta/tapai/hazur differentiation. You do recall Shakespearean ye, thy etc; don't you? We are little too lame to get over these. 

While majority of the people are into their own lives, perhaps the secluded minority of aristocrats needed some way to distinguish and feel better about themselves. So address each other, strictly within the group, gave a sense of superiority. But you real analyse their mindset, perhaps some people wonder if it in fact an inferiority complex. 

I think rethink sees it already, that if you replace 'hazur' by just 'tapai' and so on; the sky is not going to fall.

(Do you truly believe that 'ta' doesn't have any negative impact on our juniors? see how confident the similar aged kids here seem compared to our kids backhome in 'ta' atmoshphere.) Just saying.

 
Posted on 06-30-13 10:17 PM     [Snapshot: 829]     Reply [Subscribe]
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Its NOT about HIgh Class AND Lower class.

Its about LEADERSHIP. Rana and Shahs' are very good on showing leadership in Nepali society.  Well, read history, I am NOT saying from my dream.  

Of course, in any society, Leaders life styles is different than the followers. And to maintain the quality of that Leadership, they create the quality of living among those followers. In a population where 95% illiteracy, followers view this as Rana and Shahs are high class.

So, its better I don't put list of followers, I don't want to create choas on Sajha.

What's happening in Nepal now?  After Ranas' and Shahs' left,  poor Nepales can't even show leadership. LOL. Thats the truth baby.



 
Posted on 07-01-13 7:46 AM     [Snapshot: 1127]     Reply [Subscribe]
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@Sexy: Aha!!! Now, I understand where you were coming in the earlier posts. There are two things you really need to work on; history and what leadership means.
 
First Leadership. Are you trying to portray Ranas and Shahas some type of god-gifted leaders? Sexy, you need some works. Excluding two or so, they were not SELECTED BY PEOPLE as their leaders. One guy ran up  the Liglig Hill in Gorkha and became the king, and barbaric Jung B Rana killed bunch of people and come to power. Everyone else HAPPENED to be born on those two families and became the rulers. Clearly, you are mixing up ‘ruler’ with ‘leader’. Sweetheart, they are immensely different phenomena.
 
Mahatma Gandhi was a leader, Thomas Jefferson was a leader. Luck to their countries, these two guys also happened to be in power later. But their leadership essentially brought them to the power. Mahabir Pun is, the guy who successfully runs a fishery after coming back from Saudi is, Bhagawan Koirala is, Anuradha Koirala is. I hope you got the idea now. But these are only publicized ones. There are many many more in everyday life who are equally important in their spheres, but just are not publicized. 
 
Your point of 95% illiteracy: Should I remind you that the education to general public was illegal during your ‘leaders’ era of 104 years? If I have to, then we’ll start a new thread on the history only.
 
Again, not everyone in power is a leader. A few political parties emerged in matter of a few months after slaying some people. Remember? I reckon you will become a heck of a follower.
 
At least judging on your idea of “Leaders life styles is different than the followers”, it asserts my point of their inferiority complex. Real leaders never see a need to do that in trivial matters like clothing or food or selective language.  
Last edited: 01-Jul-13 07:53 AM
Last edited: 01-Jul-13 07:54 AM

 
Posted on 07-01-13 7:54 AM     [Snapshot: 1127]     Reply [Subscribe]
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SIS, if you read again, you are contradicting yourself.

Rana and Shah are the leaders in looting, and they're still looting the nation. They provided leadership in looting the nation, raping the indigenous culture. Weren't Ranas the ones not wanting anyone to get educated back then? Aren't Ranas and Shahs enjoying the loots they made decades ago? Pashupati Shamsher and Pradip Shamsher Rana (ex IGP) increased their wealth from corruption. If I remember correctly, Pradip shamhser was even fined/jailed for corruption. Aarju Rana is known for corruption among her circles.

I am not generalizing for every Rana and Shah. There are good people in every community. I respect Diamond Shamsher Rana and his writings should be eye-opener for anyone saying Ranas were good leaders. They were acting like animals or a group of gang members involved in various criminal activities.

No wonder, this journalist thinks he's of high class. SIS belongs to the mindset of this journalist:
lifedaily.net/indian-journalist-narayan-pargaien-criticised-for-filing-report-from-the-shoulders-of-a-rescued-flood-victim/


 
Posted on 07-01-13 8:47 AM     [Snapshot: 1194]     Reply [Subscribe]
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Posted on 07-01-13 8:51 AM     [Snapshot: 1176]     Reply [Subscribe]
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 to Zootimes,
              this is really a point to make  fun at someone ethnically !!  " headache when some people speak tata mata lata pata etc...   May be I wanna be simple guy too." My white American dudes don't make fun at me when I speak English American way !!!!!. coz even this is not my mother tongue.
Last edited: 01-Jul-13 08:57 AM
Last edited: 01-Jul-13 08:58 AM

 
Posted on 07-01-13 9:28 AM     [Snapshot: 1262]     Reply [Subscribe]
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I will not address discriminatory comments talking about particular castes (Ranas/Shahs/Shresthas); As I said earlier, Eutab does bring interesting point. Let's address that w/o making this thread a racially charged tirade.

"Kiddo, are you somehow offended by my comments? I am not proposing to force my way into everyone's throat. Not at all. I am not really, still why are you so afraid of looking 'in' from the western's viewpoint? "

So, if I respond to your argument, I am offended? No, I am not offended. As far as afraid of looking, just because I don't agree with a vantage point that makes me afraid of the view? I don't think you understood my reference of "western definition of equality." I can expand on this, but to summarize, I am referring to the fact that cultural bias and practices are not always a bad thing and doesn't need to be weighed from a different (western) view point which doesn't understand the context of practice. Yes, I can't judge each and every practice from western view point, specially if the practice is not an unfair one. I can expand on this if you want, but let's go to your next point.

"Call it modernism, call it democracy, call it westernization, call it whatever...all are headed in the same direction..from the US to Nepal, Tashkant to Tehran." 

Call it English, Nepali, Arabic or Amharic, language is an identifier of a community/culture and doesn't need to be assimilated in the name of progress. Hajur/tapai are parts of language, let's not act as if we are talking about a satanic ritual that needs to be weeded out here.

"Now, let's talk history: basically every culture held that ta/tapai/hazur differentiation. You do recall Shakespearean ye, thy etc; don't you? We are little too lame to get over these."

What makes you think that what English did is the right thing and we are wrong? Even with the premise that they were right, didn't we go from "Twam" (sanskrit) to "timi/hajur?" Hey, we changed too..we must be good as well then.

"While majority of the people are into their own lives, perhaps the secluded minority of aristocrats needed some way to distinguish and feel better about themselves."

Why didn't you make this accusation to any other dialects of Nepal that is different to the mainstream language used by most? Go to Darchula and the Nepali spoken there is slightly different, should I say they wanted to seclude themselves from the herd because they wanted to feel better? Since I am not a historian, let's say I go with your point and say this group of people decided to use the "aristocratic" language to feel better about themselves; was any harm done to the masses? Is this wrong? Was this language prohibited from use by any other caste (on the contrary, you might agree that the language goes beyond the caste the posters seem to refer to).

"So address each other, strictly within the group, gave a sense of superiority. But you real analyse their mindset, perhaps some people wonder if it in fact an inferiority complex."

That's one possibility, I can also suggest that people who view it as an inferiority complex might have the same complex. One group of people uses a different kind of language to address, another group of people is offended by it, who's got the complex? 

"I think rethink sees it already, that if you replace 'hazur' by just 'tapai' and so on; the sky is not going to fall."

And if we don't the sky is going to fall? Why stop at Tapai? Why not timi? Why separate? Doesn't English language address each age group same? You are okay with distinction between tapai and timi, and not with tapai and hazur.

(Do you truly believe that 'ta' doesn't have any negative impact on our juniors? see how confident the similar aged kids here seem compared to our kids backhome in 'ta' atmoshphere.) Just saying. 

You think calling our juniors "ta" drove down their confidence? I am more close to friends who I call "ta" than those who I call "timi" (or even "tapai"), I must be doing a severe injustice to their confidence. Fact is, the word in itself doesn't have any connotation-it's the context you use it with. My folks call me "ta", my friends call me "ta," I never had any issue with it. Trust me, I have friends (and even I consider myself as one in the group) who have more confidence than the kids around here. It has nothing to do with "ta" or "timi" or "hajur" but how you were raised and values you were taught.

 
Posted on 07-01-13 1:33 PM     [Snapshot: 1481]     Reply [Subscribe]
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We should not care about thier wording or how they talk. It should  not bother you.
If it does , then
mind your own business.

Last edited: 01-Jul-13 04:03 PM

 
Posted on 07-01-13 1:38 PM     [Snapshot: 1489]     Reply [Subscribe]
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 IF they call each other My Lord, or Bhagabaan or whatever the fudge they want what is it to you MORONS ?  Chahiney ta kura garnu parcha ni. Freakin' MANGINAS dwelling on petty lil' things. 
 
Posted on 07-01-13 6:17 PM     [Snapshot: 1650]     Reply [Subscribe]
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 @eutab4

Discussion my ass......bring up the good discussion. 

 
Posted on 07-01-13 6:40 PM     [Snapshot: 1666]     Reply [Subscribe]
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Hello Shrestha Babu,

You being a Newar, why do you dominate other Newars such as Jyapu. For me you all are the same. You are the one who discriminates other castes and now you are advocating against  other community's culture. You fix your own attitude first.

Take care dude.
Last edited: 01-Jul-13 06:40 PM

 
Posted on 07-01-13 10:21 PM     [Snapshot: 1877]     Reply [Subscribe]
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nepalibudo,
Yeh you are right , there is a big discrimination among newars. Shrestha discriminate jyappu,podey, kasai etc coz they are low cast newars, wheras bajracharya, shakya, rajbhandari dont give a f**k to shrestha coz they are higher caste. I think  Adibasi Janajati Newars need to fix that problem.



 



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